Silver Bay or Chestnut?

Certainly looks silver bay do you have any more pics of parents?

looks like a chestnut or silver bay. I cant tell

I'll ask for some more of the dam, I have seen heaps but never saved them as she was a pretty normal pangare chestnut haffie looking mare. She doesn't look silver bay herself at all. Sire is a very obvious black and white tobi.

[img]http://colouredcobsofcranmore.webs.com/…]

Any chance the stallion has Cream?? :rofl
Seriously I think there is something else going on and it may well be Silver.
If you had not said the mare was Haflinger I would say for sure....and I have[i] no[/i] idea if Haflingers have Silver.

If Haffies have any Ardennes in their ancestry I'd be willing to bet that they do have some silver hidden under all their flaxen chestnut.

It is very, very possible Haflingers have silver. It's virtually proven some American Belgians have silver and we know Comtois do. I don't know if there is ANY relation in those breeds, I'm just saying there are multiple breeds that carry silver and it's not noticed due to their history or current phenotype.

That being said, however, I don't think the foal looks silver. I just see sooty.

I managed to find a very DARK haflinger stallion. He's said to be once of the last registered/licensed of his unique dark liver color. He does look awfully chestnut to me, but I figured I'd toss it out there. I also found a haflinger cross mare that is half POA. The POA sire is said to be bay appaloosa, but the resulting foal was tested to be silver bay. No pictures of the parents so take it what it's worth.

Dark Haflinger: http://www.haflinger-luber.de/index2.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; Click on Unsere Pferde and then click on the picture for Liz.Steiermark

Here's the appaloosa haffie cross mare: http://www.equine.com/horses-for-sale/h…" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
She had a silver buckskin colt from a cremello something. They were tested by animalgenetics I think...

OMG - the panic that sets in me just looking at those second linked photos! Holy moly.

I do think the foal is silver bay and the mare may well be hiding the silver, OR the foal is infact a dark palamino and the dam or sire carries cream but I think the former for likely....look at this boy on a friend's wesbite -

http://www.chywoonstud.com/yearlings.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[quote="Jenks"]OMG - the panic that sets in me just looking at those second linked photos! Holy moly.[/quote]

Is it about the... surroundings? If it is just do what I did and imagine something else.

[quote="lipigirl"]look at this boy on a friend's wesbite -

http://www.chywoonstud.com/yearlings.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;[/quote]

That yearling is a similar colour, same faint points, just that the filly I posted is harder to see with more white on the legs.

They call him silver chestnut though, Chywoon Rustys Queen of Hearts, could it be silver bay and they just tested for silver not red/black??

As far as I know are Haflingers flaxen - and the flaxen gene breeds true in many decendants with a chestnut coat. As the foal grows older the colour of mane and tail should become more creamy and less pure white.
I don´t believe he´s silver - I miss the dark rims around the ears which are telltale for a black based horse.

Dr. Ramsey tested Haflingers and found the silver dilution so silver is definitely a possibility.

[quote="Monsterpony"]Dr. Ramsey tested Haflingers and found the silver dilution so silver is definitely a possibility.[/quote]

Huh, that's awesome. I googled him after you mentioned that and I found this website that mentions it: http://www.havenwoodfarms.com/eyes.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; That's awesome. :D

Why don't you have her tested for silver?

As I said in the first post, yes she's being tested. Was just interested in opinions :)

[quote="Monsterpony"]Dr. Ramsey tested Haflingers and found the silver dilution so silver is definitely a possibility.[/quote]

I didn't think he tested anything??

[quote="Jenks"]OMG - the panic that sets in me just looking at those second linked photos! Holy moly.[/quote]

No crap! HOLY GEEBUS! Lets see, yearling stallion out with mares, YOUNG foal being bitten by older weanlings/yearlings and sniffing with a stallion (anybody watch Cloud? Where that stallion picked up a foal and killed it by tossing it around a bit?)..... Uh horse in dog kennel?

Crap. Poor horses.

I think Flaxen Chestnut.

Would you mind if I piggy back one of my mares on this? I'm having the same conundrum with her as you are with your boy. I keep going back and forth between sorrel and silver bay. She's a double registered mini.

She does have mottling (mouth, eyes, and private areas), sclera, and roaned out extensively over the past two or three years (she was not roan until she was 3 or 4, she's 7 now). There doesn't appear to be a spot pattern in the roaning. Her facial markings have also roaned. I have bad pics of her as a new foal as well (about a week or less old). Oddly enough, the roan is most obvious in winter coat. She clips off to a peachy color. Her mane and tail are white (when her tail isn't pee stained, that is). There is no color change in her mane from the white pinto markings, to the areas from her chestnut color areas. She does have body colored guard hairs on her mane.

I know the roan throws a wrench in this. There are so many things that could be causing it.

Sire is bay roan pintaloosa (think he's pintaloosa anyway- kinda hard to tell), and dam is silver bay. Both of them are pictured in the album.

Any opinions?

http://s947.photobucket.com/albums/ad31…" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Wow she is a bit similar. I think flaxen chestnut as well, though she is an interesting shade.

LOL, she's like a mini version of the one I put up! But I think she's flaxen chestnut? I'm still going to go with silver bay for the one I put up I think :? I wish the test results would hurry up!!

Oh my yes -- I wish they would hurry with testing.

Well the filly I put up at the start of this topic has come back as silver!! UKY was being rather slow... and that's just what's she's been told over the phone today after being told a week ago the results were sent out. So she might retest at animal genetics, or at least wait until she gets the full report until getting super excited. But it does seem like the filly is silver bay!!

[quote="Monsterpony"]Dr. Ramsey tested Haflingers and found the silver dilution so silver is definitely a possibility.[/quote]

That makes me wish I had some extra cash laying around so I could test my haffy girl just for kicks...LOL. Any idea what lines seemed to carry silver? or was it random?
http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/preciou…" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; there is a pic of her attached on that

They don't know the breeding of the mare who was the dam of the silver filly, she was just sold to them as an unregistered Haflinger?!

[img]http://www.faewillowfarm.com/photos/UNF…]

Danni - the filly is Flaxen Chestnut with Mealy. That really faint counter shading you have a photo of, it's the same as what you see on the mare, and that's all it is. Not strong enough to be straight-forward sooty, just part of the shading. But I truly don't think she is silver.

As for Silvers being in Halflingers, the only thing I could find on Dr. Ramsey is from 12 years ago and it doesn't say how he examined the horses, if it was genetic testing, or just observation. If it was observation, that should be dismissed due to other modifying factors (I don't think there was a test for silver 12 years ago any way). In 2006 there was an article published testing silver in horses. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/article…" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; the only name I know on there is Cothrans, and I think that Halflingers were used as a control breed because that are considered a fixed-color breed.

It could very well be that there are silver halflingers out there...would I call them halflingers? Probably not, since they wouldn't necessarily fit the breed standard. Just like how there were at one point silver horses in the friesian bloodline.

ImperialAcres - if you are talking about the mare labeled Unique, I think she is just flaxen chestnut. It's reinforced even more by the fact her coat color doesn't change at all between winter and summer coats. I don't know if all silvers change color, but all non-sooty bay-based silvers I've seen so far change color from summer to winter.

I mistyped previously. I should have said that Haflingers were found to have MCOA, which is either highly linked or caused by the silver gene. Given that Haflingers are all chestnut (thus hiding the presence of silver) and that the silver gene has been in existence in European horses for over 1000 years, I don't understand how Haflingers (having existed as a breed for only around 200 years) having silver would make them not true haffies.

[quote="Monsterpony"]I don't understand how Haflingers (having existed as a breed for only around 200 years) having silver would make them not true haffies.[/quote]

Because halflingers are one of those breeds that have a color standard. While if by some chance you found an Ee halfie, I would question their purity because this breed has been dominantly chestnut for a very long time.

Since chestnuts carry the silver gene without expressing it phenotypically, there is no way to determine the silver status of purebred Haffies without gene testing and thus no one would even know they carried it.