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Appy expert help please

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supaspot60
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Appy expert help please
a friend has asked me to put her mare and foal on here , the foal pic is not great but see what you can do with it (not the foal at foot )the sire is a black leopard spot , the mare has very speckled skin - udders eyes vulva , the horse is owned by an experienced spotty breeder and she says its not the normal appy spotting , !!
rabbitsfizz
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What are you actually

What are you actually asking??
The mare looks like she started out an extended blanket, then varnished......

website: please come and visit... http://www.shadowplayminihorses.co.uk/

Daylene Alford
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Oh that is a really tough

Oh that is a really tough call. The mare looks dark chestnut in that photo but we've all seen photos of appy messing with base colors so she may not be. The foal may be black but as you said it's not a great photo.

RiddleMeThis
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I see pink skin and a bright

I see pink skin and a bright blue eye on baby. I wouldn't be surprised if the baby was classic champagne.

IMAGE(http://alterna-tickers.com/tickers/generated_tickers/i/ikmc9z103.png)

supaspot60
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I didnt mention champagne

I didnt mention champagne because I didn want to plant a wrong seed in peoples minds but the owner also thought the foal could be classic champagne

she said of the mare ......
her mums spots are a beautiful colour...have a gold sheen to them, Ive not seen anything quite like it

supaspot60
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sorry ...she wants to know

sorry ...she wants to know what colour they are

hee hee RF ..that is the name of the forum I posted in lol

Threnody
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Mother is could be champagne

Mother is could be champagne and passed it onto the foal, if it's eyes are lighter. It would explain why the mare's spots are so small if she has a dilution. I agree with rabitsfizz on the blanket that varnished.

There is a slight (very slight)chance she could be a supressed PATN 1, since they can resemble that pattern, (Appy Project has some examples in their gallery, but you have to be a member to see them) The only real way to prove she is a suppressed PANT1 is if she produces a full leopard or fewspot foal from a varnish mate.

supaspot60
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Threnody wrote: The only real

The only real way to prove she is a suppressed PANT1 is if she produces a full leopard or fewspot foal from a varnish mate.

that would never happen , the mare belongs to mandy from hallmarked stud and she has several well marked stallions

Threnody
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The more I'm looking at her

The more I'm looking at her the more I'm thinking suppressed PANT1 >.< :P I went back to look at the gallery of suppressed leopard complex and she looks almost identical to a few horses they have there. The small spots, the spots mainly on the rump and face with the shoulders roaned out. Base color shift the "LP dilute" could explain the lighter colors quite easily in both, and the lighter golden tones in the mare's dam. That is if they test negative for CH.

supaspot60
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test results ...negative for

test results ...negative for champagne

critterkeeper
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sorry.

:-? So that rules that theory out...next theory?

Kylene "A dog has lots of friends because he wags his tail and not his tongue." ~ Anonymous

Threnody
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Maybe LP really depigmented

Maybe LP really depigmented the visible skin? It's not uber common, but it does happen. Is there a possibility of cream that could have caused lighter than normal baby blues in the foal?

supaspot60
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I dont think so but Ill ask

I dont think so but Ill ask her

LesliKathman
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Here is my own suppressed

Here is my own suppressed leopard with a rather pronounced color shift.

IMAGE(http://www.horsecolor.info/Sprinkles.jpg)

See how pale her lower legs are? Yet she is Ee/aa. In person the lightest areas have a sheen to them, though the rest of her coat is pretty dull in tone.

I also did a blog post back when I had her tested, all with comparison photos of the legs of other colors. You can see those here.

I need to get more recent pictures of her. She has taken a long time to develop spotting on her face and forehand, but they are there now.

Threnody
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A phenotype like Leslie's

A phenotype like Lesli's horse is what made me think the mare is a suppressed leopard. Thanks for sharing!

LesliKathman
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This post has a set of

This post has a set of graphics that show how a normal leopard pattern ("nose to toes") gets shrunk down with whatever causes the suppression.

Suppressed Leopards

Although the name makes it sound like it would make horses less like appaloosas, in fact the suppression of the pattern tends to make them appear louder because the spotting is so dense. Each individual spot is smaller, but because the spacing is reduced the effect is that there is more there, not less.

supaspot60
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wow love that msare , shes

wow love that mare , shes gorgeous ! I must admit Ive never even heard of supressed leopards but what you describe could definately describe mandys mare
I asked mandy about the cream gene and this is what she said
"her eyes are now changing, they are no longer bue, they are going dark.
Her mane is coming through white, and she has a white undercoat too.
She tested negative for Champagne, and to my knowledge neither parent carries cream, but I havent tested."

pandemonium