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LP and lack of tail/mane?

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Itz
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LP and lack of tail/mane?
I found a fairly old discussion at another site, where paralells were drawn between lack och hair in tail and mane and the LP-complex. People were basically being told that one aspect of getting a horse with "spots" (the exact gene that was supposed to cause the lack of hair was not mentioned, as the person didn't mention either LP or patn1/patn2) would also mean that the horse would probably not get a lot of mane/tail. Now, I'm not in any way an expert when it comes to the LP-complex. I do know how LP and patn1/patn2 works and what kind of patterns/characeristics they create in different combinations, but I'm far from an expert. I would however like to know if there in fact is a connection between lack of tail/mane and the genes. I know appaloosas often come with quite small amounts of hair in mane/tail, but on the other hand there are lots of spotted breeds with a whole lot of mane and tail hair. It sounds a bit odd to me, but I'd really like to hear more about this, if anyone knows anything about it.
Threnody
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There is. Some, but not all

There is. Some, but not all LP horses can have sparse manes and tails. This often affects black colored manes and tails more than chestnut ones. Some horses manes and tails turn white during the LP roaning process and the old hairs will actually fall out and then regrow back in white. The newly colored white hairs are often able to grow longer than the pigmented ones that came before. It appears to be a LP activated trait but I personally don't know more about why it acts this way or its inheritance.

Itz
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That's very interesting! I

That's very interesting! I didn't know that, so thanks a lot for the explanation! Interesting to hear about the difference in color as well. Since chestnuts seem to be affected more by white markings, greying out faster ect, I would have assumed that it was the other way around when it came to the hair falling out.
And since the hair grow back as you say - does that mean that the thin tails are mostly just a passing phase as the horse is roaning out, or is it somethin that's permanent in some cases?

Why I was wondering was because when looking at appaloosas I personally seem to have found a lot of those "rat-tails", but on the other hand most Knabstruppers I've seen (both on photos an irl) haven't looked a lot different than ordinary WB's. Same thing goes with the British Spotted ponies that a few friends of mine have, where all of them have had nice looking tails. That made me wonder if there's anything more - perhaps breed related instead of color - to it than just LP.

It would be very interesting to hear more about te subject, so if anyone would know more about this then I'd love to hear about it!

CMhorses
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It seems like the sparse

It seems like the sparse mane/tail could be related to lp, or it could just be a trait that happened to also be in horses that had lp, and was bred out of some animals (minis for example). I know the varnish mini we have, who is black silver, has the thickest mane on the entire farm, his is probably 2in wide.

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gypsycobs
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My spotties have heaps of

My spotties have heaps of hair even when spotty mare rubbed most of her tail out butt pressing before she had the foal (mane is on other side in this pic)

NZ Appaloosas
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As you can see, "sparse"

As you can see, "sparse" isn't quite the word here...that tail is 100% natural, no special care and 24/7 turnout. Foal's tail at 1mo is almost down to the hocks, and the sire's tail is longer than the dam's.

NZ Appaloosas
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some have good manes/tails,

some have good manes/tails, some don't.

JNFerrigno
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Working for an appy breeder

Working for an appy breeder myself, I don't feel it's linked to a pattern. I do see it in some bloodlines. And some breeders would tell you that if your appaloosa was a foundation appaloosa it would have a rat tail. But really with all the breeds allowed to cross into it, I think it's a trait that can be bred out regardless of pattern.

And minis are just hairballs as it is LOL When DON'T they have manes/tails thick as mud lol

Monsterpony
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My appy had the thickest tail

My appy had the thickest tail I've ever seen (and that's including Fjords and ponies), but it only grew down to his hocks. His mane was a wispy mohawk.

.

Threnody
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I think it could very well be

I think it could very well be activated by LP as I have yet to see a non LP appaloosa with a natural rat tail not caused by a skin condition or worms. From what I've read the appaloosa project appears to believe it is an LP activated trait.

If this is the case it means that many non LP horses could carry it but not express it without the presence of LP. And it could be 'bred out' (or at least bred into significantly reduced numbers) given enough time if most of a breed had LP to make sure those without it passed on their genetics.

NZ Appaloosas
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Except...the photo I used to

Except...the photo I used to show a "crappy appy" tail is from a snowcap, who is around 97% "foundation". The first non-appaloosa is in the 4th generation, and is only 1 line.

As I said, some have it, some don't.

Diane