Is it fair to say the jury is still out
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Re: Is it fair to say the jury is still out
^what she said
They've got something that is sending all their pigment to the stripy parts. when you cross them they only get some of the color organized into stripes.
edit...wait...would that technically make it like...say...a bay with black AND white stripes? :laugh1
Re: Is it fair to say the jury is still out
Here is a link to a picture of a pinto Zorse -
http://paradoxoff.com/zorse-zebra-and-h…" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
and this one -
http://www.spotsnstripes.com/Zorses.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Re: Is it fair to say the jury is still out
I wondered that CK...it would be interesting to test the stripes, but they are non-chimeric, for sure, too easily inherited.
I am pretty sure they are black stripes, as the black stays constant on whatever base...if they were white with black stripes the white would stay constant, surely??
Re: Is it fair to say the jury is still out
Remember the Quagga? http://www.quaggaproject.org/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Looks like black stripes. In fact going by these zebras it looks like extreme dun.
Re: Is it fair to say the jury is still out
[quote="Heather"]Id like to see a zebra bred to a EEaa see if it hides any sign of it.[/quote]
I dunno but I love the stripes on this one :shock:
http://pets.webshots.com/photo/10662574…" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
this whole album is cool:
http://pets.webshots.com/album/31908506…" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
and where is it???I want it! It's a splashed white zorse!!! :lol:
http://pets.webshots.com/photo/10319125…" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Re: Is it fair to say the jury is still out
It's official for me... the Quaggas convinced me. It's extreme dun. The white striped aren't really white at all, just SUUUUPER diluted dun tone (in some photos you can see the stripes are truly not even white). How COOL!!! :bounce
Re: Is it fair to say the jury is still out
This is all so interesting, as a woman who raises zebras - a real authority on them - says they're black with white stripes. Goofily, so does Wikipedia...but I know that's not [i]exactly[/i] a perfect source. Wikipedia sure has a compelling argument, however! which includes Quaggas.
Re: Is it fair to say the jury is still out
How do the Quaggas aid the argument of white stripes on black? I thought they did more of the opposite?
How does your zebra source explain the zebra crosses that have no white stripes, but do have black stripes?
I'm not trying to challenge you, I'm just curious of their thought processes.
Re: Is it fair to say the jury is still out
I can definitely see them being extreme dun...but on what kid of base? One of my questions is, are they similar to donkeys? I mean they can be red or black based same as horses. One of my theories thinking about this is I havn't seen many 'extreme grullo' zebroids, but I think this one could possibly be.
[img]http://i287.photobucket.com/albums/ll15…]
The quagga project to me shows that they could have bay or something,but I'm not sure if the coat colors even 'match' up with horses genetically.(I would think if they were all black based then they would all be EE so then we would never have a chestnut zebroid or even a red based zedonk.)
On another side note. Wow! This is weird...look at the striping on the zebroid that is half fjord to the one of an 'unknown breed'
[img]http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_Ya6G8yeCQLU/S…]
When I eventually get a zebra...I'll let you breed it to an EE horse,Heather.
Re: Is it fair to say the jury is still out
I have never, apart form the obvious money angle, been able to understand why anyone would cross a Zebra with anything.
They are WILD, not feral, undomesticated....WILD animals!!!
ARGH, my head is going to asplode and ruin my keyboard and I'll have you know it cost me $2.00 at a Boot Sale!!! :rofl
I think it is completely obvious they are a base colour + black stripes, how can they be anything else??
I also think that it is more than possible that this is just extreme primitive markings, and the forerunner of Dun as we know it.
The Fjord may well have Cream, of course, which could make that cross a Smoky Black Extreme Dun??
Re: Is it fair to say the jury is still out
They cross them for the novelty mostly, and people are starting to show and register zebras and zebra crosses. So eventually there will be 'domesticated' zebras,I know with every generation they become a little more 'tame'. I personally want one for the experience of training it and possibly showing it.
I think it is more likely they are EEAA, the Quagga Project's zebras started going reddish not black and that would explain why most zebroids I've seen are bay and not chestnut or black.
Re: Is it fair to say the jury is still out
[quote="Maigray"]If the Fjord has cream perhaps it is inhibiting the striping, because otherwise you would think crossing a dun on a dun would produce greater expression, but it has reduced it sharply.[/quote]
...unless of course if the Zebra stripes have nothing at all to do with Dun in which case it may not be the reason that it expresses less, you would need to see many more Duns x Zebras to see if it's the Dun or cream.... but I can see where you are going with this - what if it's like Homozygous appies producing less pattern as in a few spot - . I am just not sure they are related yet.
Re: Is it fair to say the jury is still out
[quote="accphotography"]How do the Quaggas aid the argument of white stripes on black? I thought they did more of the opposite?
How does your zebra source explain the zebra crosses that have no white stripes, but do have black stripes?
I'm not trying to challenge you, I'm just curious of their thought processes.[/quote]
Ha! I, of course, do NOT know enough about it to question her in any way..... :) ;) She told me, she lives with zebras, I believed her. ;) (of course, at that time, I thought it was a known fact, not debatable in any way - or I might have asked more)....
The Wikipedia reference shows how they put those quaggas in their argument ("zebra" on wikipedia).
That all being said....I think it's at least safe to say the answer is still not [i]entirely[/i] clear, which is the only thing I need to make the sentence funny. Thanks! :rofl :rofl :laugh1 :laugh1
Re: Is it fair to say the jury is still out
[u]Plains Zebra (Burchell's, common)[/u] have wide stripes with shadowing in the white, between the black stripes.
[img]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/c…]
[u]Mountain Zebras[/u] have a dewlap and white bellies, with no striping.
[img]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/c…]
[u]Grevy's Zebra[/u] has thinner stripes with stripes reaching down to the hooves. The belly and base of the tail lack stripes, similar to Mountain.
[img]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/c…]
[u]Quagga[/u]
[img]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/c…]
[b]Dilute discussion?[/b]
[img]http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2129/221…]
In case photo doesn't show up:
http://animalphotos.info/a/2008/02/01/u…" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Close-up of a zebra face/markings:
[img]http://animalphotos.info/a/2008/02/01/s…]
Interesting:
[img]http://farm1.static.flickr.com/44/18893…]
Re: Is it fair to say the jury is still out
If I'm not mistaken, that diluted looking zebra is considered an albino. (However cream (MATP) in horses is considered an albinism gene so *shrug*.)
The white ear tips on the last one is interesting as that is another thing extreme dun does (along with the odd mottling below the ear dip). Also check the ventral on the one laying down (despite the non striped belly).
Re: Is it fair to say the jury is still out
Think as if they were some color other than 'white' .You would then say they are x color with black stripes. Same with a grullo horse, you would say they are 'greyish' with black stripes, even though they are black based. What makes the stripes is the color between them is inhibited/diluted so even thinking about that, I would still say they are 'white' with black stripes because the stripes do not get diluted.
Re: Is it fair to say the jury is still out
Well at first I thought it was white stripes on black.
And then common sense hit me, and now Im fairly certain its black stripes on white. Because, when you breed a horse (or anything) to a zebra, you dont get white stripes on the dark background. You get black stripes.