Tobiano Sabino Rabicano?

Actually, I feel like I'm seeing frame for some reason. Is that foal of his frame?

I'm not seeing frame on this one but can see the Tobi and Rabicano poss Sabino too.

The foal possibly is. Looks Tobi, Rab, and Frame. I didn't realize I could enlarge it till this morning. Hmm. So is that pattern on the stallion what they call calico overo, where it's these lacey egg drop edges.

I've no idea about the Calico bit but who's to say the frame came for the stallion ?

Well they did say the foal "inherited his color" so I'd suspect the dam didn't have color to pass (yes, I know frame's can be solid, but I see frame in the sire).

Hm. My terms are all out dated, and again this is going back to when the LW test was first developed. But in a paper done by...Mickelson? (not sure if he was the head of the research). I think they identified 7(?) patterns of 'overo' giving them all different names. Calico was one of them, and it described this Lacey spotted edging. Which I believe is now thought to be caused by Sabino (or something else as that to has become an umbrella term). Heck that stallion could have Sabi, Tobi, Frame, and Rab. LOL Who knows.

I think listing him as a "Tobiano" when he is quite obviously a real mixture of patterns is pushing it a bit. He is a lot of things but he is not, obviously, Tobiano, in fact you have to look hard to find it.
I just wish people would actually exercise their brains and [i]try[/i] to understand at least the basics.
"Lab tested Tobiano" I could live with, but what is the betting he isn't tested?
Is he HYPPD tested?

He doesn't have Impressive in his bloodlines and it's pretty obvious he doesn't have HYPP. They call him Tobi because that's how he's registered. You can't let these little things get to you Fizz. You'll go crazy! LOL You know those darn registries will go changing what you put in there? Now that is annoying.

Fizz are you saying that you don't see tobiano in there?

Finally found the info I needed. Skips Par Suasion his sire is registered overo with the APHA, but I can't find a photo of him. I did find a list of his offspring with registered color, which i feel support the fact that Skips Par Suasion is overo. So chances are he could have inherited it as well. Can't find a dime on his dam tho.

His dam is listed sorrel tobiano and has no [i]obvious[/i] frame behind her.

IMO the stallion is VERY obviously Tobiano.

I agree I can see tobi there ...why don't you see it Fizz?

She didn't say she didn't see it, just that she saw other patterns first and had to look to find the tobi. I see what she means (though I agree tobi is obvious, something else is at play as well).

I see so many patterns that, no, the Tobiano is [i]not[/i] obvious, you have to look to find it.
He is not "A" Tobiano, as such, he is merely a horse that, among other pattens, [i]has[/i] Tobiano, he also has Splash and Sabino, so why not call him an "overo"?

If we're going to be dropping the o-bomb we might as well call him a tovero. :D

At first glance I thought tobiano, though. When I look closer he looks like a weird tobiano, but I do think, for most people, tobiano stands out the most.

[quote="Third Peppermint"]If we're going to be dropping the o-bomb we might as well call him a tovero. :D

At first glance I thought tobiano, though. When I look closer he looks like a weird tobiano, but I do think, for most people, tobiano stands out the most.[/quote]

ooooooo now we are on fighting talk !! :rofl

[quote="rabbitsfizz"] he also has Splash and Sabino, so why not call him an "overo"?[/quote]
Because he is much more obviously tobiano than splash and sabino.

Which characteristics make you see splash? I was half expecting ACC to drop the DW bomb on me (cause that's what's been screwing me up).

I am not seeing tobiano. It looks like a similar pattern to me, but something about it just doesn't say tobi. I can't put my finger on it though.

The thing is, I don't think it can be DW without tobi. I've never seen DW take the topline with that little white. One of the things saying "maybe not tobi" to me is the fact that the white is pushing up the front of the back legs as opposed to the back... that is NOT a tobi thing.

But isn't that a Sabino thing? The same spotty pattern is seen in Frame horses which carry sabino as well.

It's a splash or DW thing IMO. In that particular shape it is more often DW.

The leg white going up the inside instead of the back is also a sabino thing, right?

But yes, the lacy patter does remind me of DW. In some cases DW and Sabino look the same, LOL and I think DW is gonna turn into another umbrella term. I wonder if maybe we're looking at wonky ink spots. Not sure what causes them, but I've seen some tobi studs in the paint journals that look like Jackson Pollock attacked them.

I don't see where the splash is coming in however.

I'd guess the splash is coming in from the movement and shape of the face and leg white, though I don't know that I'd have said it unless the horse was known to be negative tobiano.

It's not so much the fact that it goes up the inside rather than the outside as that the outside part is flat and square THEN the inside jumps up. That's not a sabino thing IMO, no.

Found another horse that looks like him. It's in German so you'll need a translator.
BM Magic Powder http://www.bluemountainranch.de/bilder_…" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; this photo he looks like he has one blue eye, but it's not very clear. The video of him shows better pattern. Still can't tell if that is a blue eye or not. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tq1CmsPc…" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; Towards the end you see him roll and put his head down, so you can see his under side. Owners call him a homozygous tobiano, and he was tested OLWS negitive.

This is one of his offspring. Magic's Moonlight Shadow http://www.mountain-hill-farm.de/hengst…" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; check out that face marking. It is interesting how it stops then continues under the jawline. Is that a DW trait?

Another son, Shy Gambling Sox http://www.bluemountainranch.de/bilder_…" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

BM Magic Top Secrete http://www.bluemountainranch.de/bilder_…" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

And just for looks, here are some other interesting horses the breeder owns:
Tobiano, Sabino? http://www.bluemountainranch.de/bilder_…" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; http://www.bluemountainranch.de/bilder_…" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://www.bluemountainranch.de/bilder_…" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; This one I like because even if minimal tobiano, you can follow the white and see whee the sheilds were supposed to be. Check out the ticked patch on the booty tho.

Cool Texas Cowboy http://www.mountain-hill-farm.de/hengst…" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; this horse isn't owned by the breeder, but is owned by the same person as Magic's Moonlight Shadow. Odd spots on white, lots of white, sheilds, and 1 blue eye. Tobiano, Sabino, and Splash?

DW throat white isn't usually disconnected, it wraps under from the blaze. The splotch of white in the area between the jowls is 100% a tobi trait IMO (lots will disagree with me, but they won't sway me LOL).