Dun puzzle

Those primitive markings could just be foal countershading.

We inspected mommy a little closer and she has stripes on her muzzle and shoulder markings - when she had a bath (we did that yesterday - but my camera was down) you can see an eel stripe down her back.
I think the eel stripe of Sierra is much to prominent and to dark to be just countershading.

Im on my phone do that may be altering things but imo baby doesn't look fun to me. Just heavy counter shading/brown.

She has the black eartips and slight cobwebbing on her forehead, black stripes at her muzzle and the neck shadowing. I´ll try to get better pics of her tomorrow, but I think a definite answer will only give us a test.
But just assumed mommy is a dun - would this make her a very dark slate grullo? Has anyone found a pic of a dun horse this shade?

No. I've never seen a known grullo anywhere near that dark.

The foal looks like typical foal countershading to me. She is a brown base and this is a typical expression of brown at birth (countershading and all).

You could test the mare for dun, but I'm very confident it will come back negative.

Here is a brown foal with no dun in his parentage:
[img]http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f298/…]

I am going to agree with the others on this one no dun in Dam or foal - beautiful non-the-less !

There is no dun showing in the mare. Having a faint dorsal stripe is fairly common in non-dun horses.

I agree with the others, no dun in either mare or foal. Very cute foal though!!

cute lil bub def looks bay with counter sahding to me. a dun would usually be lighter and dam has no dun either, even on a black base you would claerly see her markings IMO.

Very pretty BTW! :)

[img]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v131/…]
[img]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v131/…]
[img]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v131/…]
[img]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v131/…]

This is Bertie, o/o a dark Red Dun, by a Silver Black.
This is the darkest Black Dun I have ever seen and he never actually looks Black, he always has a cast to his coat and the dorsal is always visible (sorry, no pictures of that as it was not relevant to what I was doing, I'll try today if I have time)

As an aside, we know Cream acts strangely with other dilutes, so might it be possible that Cream inhibits Dun expression as it does Silver?

I actually don't think this colt is Dun, he looks Bay to me, with countershading, I was just tossing the Cream thing out there........

*[size=85]feel free to ignore the sleep deprived Hobbit[/size]*

I never would guess Bertie was black dun. So are you saying he's silver too and that it repressed both genes expression? ?

How do we know Bertie is dun?

I bet she will say through breeding, but...waiting....

No, he does not have Silver, I think it would be obvious if he did, not sure, but it would affect his mane and tail at the least, surely?
No Cream.
He is not proven, he is a gelding, but it was quite obvious when he was a foal, and I looked at his dorsal this arvo and it is obvious too, but, since I no longer know which way is up, I took no pictures!!!
He does have the ears as well, the cream inside the ears thing, I know that does not prove anything but we now have
1) a Dorsal
b) darker lower legs
III) creamy inner ears and dark lining round them.
iv) he has a Dun parent!!!
He could be Black, it is genetically possible, but he has never looked Black, not real Black, Black......