Do you REALLY think this is just bleaching?

It could be something else but I think its just fading. I've seen horses look almost exactly like this that I know for certain were just faded. The first is a faded brown the second is either brown or black.

I'd love to see a black or brown horse that is faded to that extreme. Something like that, is hard for me to get my head around after working with so many horses who spent all their time out side here in the Florida sun. If that were the case, and it wasn't caused by something else, I'd expect to see more of an occurrence in our feral horse herds.

What about them caused you to feel they would be solid and undiluted by the Cream gene?

And what about the theory that in the Agouti Loci's some are more prone to fading? I don't know if I'm getting that right, and I forget where I had heard it before.

I would have automatically guessed sooty buckskin for the mare, and quite possibly the same thing for the daughter, tho I'd like to know how old the daughter was. And I doubt ACC would post something so easy to guess LOL.

this is my sunbleached black (tested) QH gelding

Well the mare looks brown, but she could be a buckskin. The filly looks a bit like a smokey black, but could just as easily be a bleached black. So I guess my answer is, I don't know LOL!!

I honestly don't know what they are, but the odds are against them being cream (though it's not certain). I just have a hard time believing it's just bleaching the more I look at them. I've seen alot of bleached horses and never seen two look like that.

Here's a known smokey brown just for comparison:
[img]http://www.accphotography.com/gallery/d…]

[img]http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b276/…] Here's a faded Anglo Arab- she faded much more than in this picture, but is now jet Black again. You can see another faded black (Arab) in the background who is also nice a colour of Black again. (we're in winter at the mo)

I think that the Dam has Cream and is faded, while Daughter may just be faded.

Do we know the colour of the parents of the Dam? Sire of the Daughter?

Yes, but I don't trust them to be accurate, especially considering these are both registered bay.

Oh yay some more photos...

http://images.craigslist.org/3n73m23p55…" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://images.craigslist.org/3n83oe3le5…" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://images.craigslist.org/3n93mf3od5…" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://images.craigslist.org/3nf3m83o75…" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://images.craigslist.org/3n03k73md5…" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://images.craigslist.org/3p23o13lc5…" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I have no idea how these make me feel except to say the filly is even creamier than I'd thought.

I don't find the mare so odd, just one of those yellower looking browny types. But the filly is weird I reckon

weird!

from what I'm seeing....that's about how pale my black SSH mare fades on her rump...maybe a bit paler. But her head doesn't fade at all...so...

interesting horses :)

Tomorrow I'll take some pics of Riot, he's pretty dang bleached and if I recall correctly is a similar color... And Jazz right now looks like a rose grey haha! Except for her scars, they have grown back in black

[quote="Krickette"]Tomorrow I'll take some pics of Riot, he's pretty dang bleached and if I recall correctly is a similar color... And Jazz right now looks like a rose grey haha! Except for her scars, they have grown back in black[/quote]

Riot? I thought Riot as a nice tabby kitten - and female...could you be thinking of Nike? rofl

Ok I didn't really read that before I looked at the pics and I thought DUH what sunbleaching, buckskins/ cream browns are SUPPOSED to look like that. Then you said very little chance of cream and someone posted a similar beastie tested black. :shock:

I guess it might be living in the UK, land of grey skies and rain but I thought a sun-bleached black was a dark chocolate brown colour on the back, black on the belly and had reddish tints to the ends of the mane. Those are crazy bleached.

[quote="critterkeeper"][quote="Krickette"]Tomorrow I'll take some pics of Riot, he's pretty dang bleached and if I recall correctly is a similar color... And Jazz right now looks like a rose grey haha! Except for her scars, they have grown back in black[/quote]

Riot? I thought Riot as a nice tabby kitten - and female...could you be thinking of Nike? rofl[/quote]

Haha, Riot is my tabby cat, yes. But I'm also riding a horse named Riot haha! He's a black tobiano arab cross...it gets confusing lol, I find myself calling all my animals the wrong names now.

Riot is such a great name for a horse....that was what my TWH gelding was named....Patriot, but Riot for short.

I wonder if it's not so much of a sun bleaching thing, as it is a genetic thing? I mean, that what ever genes they carry cause the expression of color to be weaker and more prone to sun bleaching. Wasn't it Angus or Holstein cows that come in black and do not fade, in fact they are supposed to reflect light or something like that?

I swear being in the 'sunshine' state, you'd think I'd see more of this. But the blacks I've worked with will bleach and just get red highlights, and the fancier farms will blanket them even in the summer. But I've honestly never seen anything like that on a black horse. Even this one Cracker herd I observed never bleached like that. This particular family was dominantly black or grey, so when I think sunbleaching, I think of this:

http://jnferrigno.deviantart.com/art/Fl…" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://jnferrigno.deviantart.com/art/Fl…" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://jnferrigno.deviantart.com/art/Fl…" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

So I took some pics of Riot (who is also a Patriot!) yesterday. They were at dusk, taken with a cellphone so they aren't the best, but they at least give you an idea. He's actually lighter irl.

in a barn:
[img]http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y291/P…]
[img]http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y291/P…]
[img]http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y291/P…]
outside:
[img]http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y291/P…]
[img]http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y291/P…]

This is what he looked like on 6/15/2010:
[img]http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y291/P…]
[img]http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y291/P…]

He's nice. Odd how there is dark skin under white hair and white skin under dark hair. Looks like shadow lines. Cool.

[img]http://www.baywindfarm.com/forum/pictur…]

older pic, but shows the yellowish looking fading my black mare gets. It eventually wraps all around her rump that same yellow-golden looking color. My first mare was a solid black and she would fade a bit in the sun, but turned a reddish tone.

and a black mare at the BSA camp I worked at....this was her "before" mugshot when she first arrived and we were gonna get her all cleaned up and pretty.....we forgot to take the afters though..haha. Massive mare that was just lovely to ride.
[img]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v485/…]