We're going to Tulsa!
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Re: We're going to Tulsa!
[quote="Andrea"]Tonight I'll turn the girls out with the halters on and see how he does. He seems to think that if there is a pony on lead, it must be for him to service... :shock:
How do I get him over that?[/quote]
Let him only breed mares with no halters from now on? :laugh1
[size=75](Just kidding. I know that's not possible, but it would probably fix it) [/size]
Re: We're going to Tulsa!
Ooh! Yes!
My friend has halters and then she has "The Halter". The [i]holiest of holies[/i], Halter: [i]...a spotlight comes out to illuminate The Halter while a "Hallelujah!" chorus crescendo's in the background, finishing with a mighty flourish of trumpets, drums and a crash of cymols!!!![/i] Only when The Halter comes out and is put on her stud is he allowed to *be* a stud, and he knows the difference, hubba-hubba!
Your boy appears very smart, you need to change his mindest off of the *other* horse's halters and headgear and onto *HIS* Halter for him to trigger on the difference in behavior he is allowed. He needs that spotlight to help the lightbulb go off in his head about the *right* idea.
Re: We're going to Tulsa!
[quote="Heidi"]Ooh! Yes!
My friend has halters and then she has "The Halter". The [i]holiest of holies[/i], Halter: [i]...a spotlight comes out to illuminate The Halter while a "Hallelujah!" chorus crescendo's in the background, finishing with a mighty flourish of trumpets, drums and a crash of cymols!!!![/i] Only when The Halter comes out and is put on her stud is he allowed to *be* a stud, and he knows the difference, hubba-hubba!
Your boy appears very smart, you need to change his mindest off of the *other* horse's halters and headgear and onto *HIS* Halter for him to trigger on the difference in behavior he is allowed. He needs that spotlight to help the lightbulb go off in his head about the *right* idea.[/quote]
I now need a new keyboard... :rofl :HB :bounce :toast
Re: We're going to Tulsa!
I have been asking that question for the last several months! I feel like I'm gonna be waking up tomorrow and saying "oh sh*t, what time is MP's flight arriving today?????" :rofl And that's with having to schedule a couple of trips that needing doing before she gets here!
Diane
Re: We're going to Tulsa!
The show runs October 1-4. We'll be showing halter on the 2nd. Love you meet who ever can come!
The problem with a halter only for breeding is that there isn't anything to breed... I've been thinking of getting an AV and then do the conditioning. But right now I have nothing to let him learn with. I don't want to breed Silo back. But I agree, he needs to learn when he is allowed to let it all hang out!
Re: We're going to Tulsa!
[quote="NZ Appaloosas"]I have been asking that question for the last several months! I feel like I'm gonna be waking up tomorrow and saying "oh sh*t, what time is MP's flight arriving today?????" :rofl And that's with having to schedule a couple of trips that needing doing before she gets here![/quote]
Me too! I am down to 8 months left of vet school (yikes! counting in months instead of years!) and only 2.75 clinical rotations before I head to the southern hemisphere!
Re: We're going to Tulsa!
Andrea there are NO short cuts to this one.
No whacking, no zinging, no cross words.
Just slow and steady and every single time he drops you back him up til it goes away.
So what if it takes half an hour?
Next time it will take less.
This is conditioning, and it takes time!
I would not be walking him round mares in an arena, not yet, not until he understands, completely, that inappropriate dropping will result in backward movement, EVERY SINGLE TIME.
It is annoying, no doubt about it, but it does work, it just is not a magic bullet!
I agree completely with the "Halter of Fame" thing, some horses do respond to that.
However, Rabbit will not cover a mare that is "naked" yet has no problem understanding that not all mares are dressed for him, he knows he does not cover in a show ring, or at a show, so there is no point in getting ready to do so.
Carlos....well, Carlos is a bit more eager and a bit readier to bully, but, basically, turning in small circles round me and walking backwards has to be the most annoying past time under the sun, so, in the end, he stops.
D.C and I are just now going through a slight difference of opinion about the speed at which he leaves his stall in the morning, but, again, passive resistance is the key. no whacking, no shouting (and I can and DO shout when necessary, believe me!) He just goes round and round in circles til he gets the message! This is where I would start with ex-Frodo, I would start merely by asking him to walk in a relaxed manner. A relaxed horse does not normally drop his tackle out (not unless he is VERY relaxed!) as soon as he tenses or arches his neck, pull his head round and stop and he will circle.
Doesn't matter how long it takes, it really doesn't!
Once he can walk out on a loose lead to wherever you are going, then, and only then, is he ready to start asking him to go anywhere near horses and not dropping.
I realise your situation is not ideal, and he may have to go past other horses, and he will drop, so long as he is relaxed and not messing around, ignore it.
You have to have your goals firmly mapped out.
Goal one. Walk relaxed not pulling.
Goal two. Do not drop.
See??
How much turn out time does he get, BTW?? He is still a very young animal and he does need "him" time.
The number of mares he covers is not really important as a horse has a moment to moment memory of around two minutes so even if he were covering ten a day he would just get tired, but probably not sated.....left out in a field a stallion usually covers a mare once, maybe twice a day for her heat cycle, but all he has in a field is "him" time!
I have to admit Rabbit and Carlos are a lot happier now I have them out all the time, D.C is only eighteen months and immature for his age, so he does not mind one way or the other!
Re: We're going to Tulsa!
Want to hear something horrible that they used to do? Where my mom once worked, with a bunch of halter QHs (back before they got ridiculous), they would take a stud colt and lay a heavy heavy blanket on him. Then they'd put him with a bunch of mean ol' mares. Because of the blanket, he couldn't mount them, and eventually learned to cool his jets. It worked, but.... yeah. We've come a long way, huh
Re: We're going to Tulsa!
I completely agree Rabbit. I've gotten him to where he walks around the property on a loose lead and without dropping. That's why I walk him in the arena with the mares. To tempt him. Even then he's a good boy but his "part" will start to drop and I point and growl at him to "tuck it" and he pulls it up.
Backing does not work so we do circles with gusto. So we still have lots of work to do and I'm very consistent with my cues to him. Something triggers that permawood though. That's the hard part. (pardon the pun :rofl )
With the permawood it takes circling, backing and growling and a good 10 minutes before he'll put it away. All this time he's very contrite and polite. That's the weird thing. He's not being disrespectful he's just got permawood! He knows as I've seen him lift his hind leg to kick it... Like he's trying to put it away! :shock:
We've got three shows in the next two months and they are longer shows so we have plenty of opportunity and time to work on manners!
I'm also thinking of getting an AV and setting up an actual breeding routine for him to work his "energy" off. I think that more than anything will be key in his understanding when it's "the time" to take it out.
Re: We're going to Tulsa!
New pictures please!! And good luck with Manyara (although I sooo love his old name better ;) ).
In reference to breeding halters, does anyone have a link or something to show me an idea at least? We use a nylon halter with stud chain for everyday stuff (I leave NO window of opportunity for disrespect!), a leather halter for showing, a rope halter for training, a big scary halter for the farrier (thanks to the idiot who flipped my poor baby over at 5 months), and have been trying to think of something creative and special that would click to Cisco's pea-brain that this means breeding, and all other stuff is everyday b.s. Ideas?
Re: We're going to Tulsa!
Akk, no, NEVER ever use a bit...I don't even like a stud chain anymore.
If you use, as we sued to, a lunge rein when covering, attached to a chain, as we used to, you do not have as much control over what is happening "up front"....I was always on the mare end, often with a pole twitch, before we moved over to a hitching post.
Standing in front of a 16.2 hh, recalcitrant, often badly behaved and spoilt mare was ten time more dangerous than standing behind a stallion we had raised, holding a lunge rein BUT...and this is the point, if the horse puts it's foot over said lunge rein as he mounts, and the mare faffs around whilst he is "in the saddle" you can end up in a situation where a stallion comes down to find he has his leg over the rein and the mare has BOTH her hind legs over the rein.
Even in the best set ups it is possible.
If the mare then goes potty, and the stallion is now attached to her by the lunge rein, think of the damage that could be done if he were to be attached by a chiffney bit (God, I HATE those bits!!) or even a bit of any sort.
I have said this before and I shall say it again, if your stallion cannot be controlled under ALL circumstances, up to and including pushing him off the mare and asking him to walk away from her (Yes, I have had to do that too!) in a halter, he needs gelding!!
It is the same as any other situation.
TRAINING.
Teach the horse to behave.
Now, training may mean, for a short time, you need a chain, just to remind him who is in charge if he forgets, but I would not use one all the time.
For me, it has always been [i]where[/i] the breeding takes place that is important.
Carlos does his breeding in the bottom pen, if I halter him and take him towards that pen (we have to go through it to get into the middle pen) he expects to find a mare, and gets on his toes. If there is no mare there he simmers down. It has nothing to do with which halter he is wearing, although these things can be very useful too, the Arabs were never bred in a bridle, so if one was put on they knew we were working. They were never bred using a show halter, so, again, time and a place, as it were!
You can imagine Rabbit's surprise when I took him round the back of a barn, at a show, to cover a friends mare for her! It took him ten minutes to work out he really, REALLY could "have" her!! And even then I got some very strange looks from him.
So, although I have used the different halters approach, I would also recommend reinforcing it with a specific area for breeding alone.
And never, nver in a bit.
PLEASE
Re: We're going to Tulsa!
We need new pics! :love