VERY cool TBs...

PtHA has become a bit of a powerhouse of an association, and I think they may be eligible there. I know I hear a lot of the show people talking nothing but good about PtHA shows.

Diane

Is it just my computer or does the tb crop out have a darker colored patch on his neck just behind the poll, and it's darkened their hair as well.

The Chestnut based horse is just a Sabino, what's crop out about it?
Surely that would be classed as "normal" white markings?
I suppose I am just so used to it in Arabs and Welsh, but, honestly, although technically it is "pinto" it is nothing unusual....
Nice horse, though.

[quote="rabbitsfizz"]The Chestnut based horse is just a Sabino, what's crop out about it?
Surely that would be classed as "normal" white markings?[/quote]
Nope, those wouldn't be "Normal" white markings. and what ACC means by crop out is that neither parent and this horses bloodlines show no indication of ever producing color like that. AKA Crop out.

He DOES have a sooty patch on his neck that colors his mane. I took some photos specifically to show it. It's very odd.

He IS a crop out, by definition, regardless of what gene caused his markings. Neither parent traces to any known major white source or is a white source themselves. He MORE than qualifies for APHA and is registered based solely on his white. That IS the definition of a cropout IMO.

Also, I say there is no way in you know where that that is only sabino. That is definitely dominant white IMO. A new mutation of it most likely.

I found out last night that his sire also produced this mare. I previously thought her marking was just a "mismark" (it's her only white)... now I know better. Something is up with this family.
http://www.echohillsporthorses.com/Imag…" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Oh and no... that would NOT be considered "normal markings" by ANY stretch of the imagination. Not in TBs for SURE! This is one of the loudest non known DW/frame TBs I have EVER seen.

I would have thought that sort of thing would have turned up more in the TB's as well, like RF said, it happens often enough with arabs and welshies etc.. I guess I've never taken enough notice of them! And back when I used to work on TB farms anything that wasn't a dilute or obvious tobiano didn't rate as 'colour' LOL!

Oh no! Definitely not the case IME. Some flash is unusual... this much is downright rare IME.

[quote="accphotography"]Oh and no... that would NOT be considered "normal markings" by ANY stretch of the imagination. Not in TBs for SURE! This is one of the loudest non known DW/frame TBs I have EVER seen.[/quote]

Do you know if they've tested for frame? We know that gene exists in TBs.

Diane

Yes!! The mare was negative!

Oh and I can pull hair and test (or send to researchers) for anything we might want to.

They all look very pretty.

But I don't see how they can be major crop outs or frame since they all look splash and/or sabino to me. And from what I know of TBs, and those patterns, it doesn't seem that strange. :?

No, I was just toying with the frame idea, based on the whole "white surrounded by colour" definition of frame, and the possibility of a major suppressor. A negative frame test takes following that possibility not worthwhile, unless there's a chance the sire could have had it?

Diane

Well the sire have it and the gelding have it and the mare have a great big spot with no leg white not have it? Nah. Easier to believe it's DW and they all three have it.

Threnody how many TBs not from known DW lines can you show that look like this?

Have seen many many thousands of TB's & ones like that fella not that very common! He is lovely.

Ok I apparently overlooked the DW posts. I can see it as a possibility, but I still think such markings are possible from the arab examples. Maybe not common, but possible. Suppressor alleles might not have passed on from the parents. Arabs have shown that suppressors can keep chrome under wraps for generations.

I would be as interested as anyone else to see if they do test for DW however. Although the mare still looks like just a missmark to me, I won't deny that it would be very neat to see if she did test for DW. ^_^

I thought the mare was a mismark... til her brother. Now I SERIOUSLY doubt that's coincidence.

Arabians have proven to have DW in at least some families.

I will probably talk to the DW researchers about this family while I can get samples from him.

Unless some mismarks, like human birthmarks, can be inherited?

Diane

That could make some sense. In that case the gelding's having so much leg and face white would be merely coincidence. Hmmm.

Re:testing for DW
Remember that there are a bunch of different mutations that produce dominant white, and probably a bunch more mutations that haven't been identified yet. So "testing negative" for DW wouldn't mean much...

Yeh DW is sort of like the 'new' sabino LOL! :sabsm

Indeed it is.

I heard back from the DW researcher and they would definitely like samples from him and as many family members as I can manage to dig up. YAY!

That's great news ^_^