Seal bay?

Black.

[color=#8000BF][b]Amazing that y'all think that!! The only thing that says black to me is his head.
Thats the only part I've seen on him that looks remotely black.
[/b][/color]

He definitely looks faded black. His face and head are solid black as are his soft spots (armpits/flanks) while the area that is exposed to the sun is faded to brown. A seal horse is almost solid black with brown/red on the muzzle and in the soft spots like this mare:
http://www.equine-color.info/index.php?…" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

(PS- I love having the attached photo gallery; it makes digging for my photos so much faster when I just have to click a color category).

Looking again, he does have cream colored ear hair and, with that much fading, he may be smokey black. Were either of his parents cream dilutes?

[quote="Monsterpony"]He definitely looks faded black. His face and head are solid black as are his soft spots (armpits/flanks) while the area that is exposed to the sun is faded to brown. A seal horse is almost solid black with brown/red on the muzzle and in the soft spots like this mare:
http://www.equine-color.info/index.php?…" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

(PS- I love having the attached photo gallery; it makes digging for my photos so much faster when I just have to click a color category).[/quote]

[color=#8000BF][b]Interesting. Well he wasn't real faded in his weanling pics as they stayed stalled a lot...so....
Who knows, I doubt the new owner will test him as he's a gelding & I don't think she cares about color.[/b][/color]

[quote="Monsterpony"]Looking again, he does have cream colored ear hair and, with that much fading, he may be smokey black. Were either of his parents cream dilutes?[/quote]

[color=#8000BF][b]His sire is the same as my filly Lacey. He's a Grullo/Roan/Gray....to my knowledge has never sired a dilute foal...don't think its possible.
His dam is a chestnut.[/b]
[/color]

He looks Black to me, too.

I agree the gelding looks black, and one of the only ones I've ever seen that fades more than Inigo!

Well, I actually agree with black based, but I think cream is a definite possibility. What's that sire's pedigree again?

[quote="accphotography"]Well, I actually agree with black based, but I think cream is a definite possibility. What's that sire's pedigree again?[/quote]

http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/sneeker…" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Is it possible to have a smokey black grullo? or would it make it something different? I noticed the stallion had cream in its pedigree, just wondered if its possible it was hidden by grullo.

Smokey black grullo (which can look like normal grullo) is a color possibilty and there is cream close to the pedigree of the sire. But either way, I wouldn't call him brown.

Actually wouldn't it just be smokey grullo as grullo is automatically black based? Or you could say smokey black dun.

Daylene

I don't think this horse's color necessary qualifies it as having cream. Have you guys forgotten how badly my blue roan colt fades? He's negative for cream.

[color=#8000BF][b]Here's a pics from today...she said he's slicking off....still looks brown lol[/b][/color]
[img]http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c33/K…]

[color=#8000BF][b]The sire has never sired a cream foal so doubt he carries cream[/b][/color]

I still see black, not brown.

I could still go with smokey black or just a really faded black. That horse is almost the same color as my little mystery colored Coco, which people think she is a smokey black.
Also, how many foals has that sire had? If there was not many, that does not mean that cream isn't a possibility.

Looking back at his younger photos, his yearling ones looked really golden, but it could have been the light.

[color=#8000BF][b]Not sure how many foals Sneeker has had...would have to look that up on AQHA.

Here are 2 sisters that used to reside at the same farm. Out 24/7...both black...no where looking like Bullet (the gelding in question).[/b][/color]
[img]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v310/…]
[img]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v310/…]

How many black based (black, grullo, etc.) foals has he had? Any one of those could have been cream and you'd never have known it. Cream could also hide on some of those babies that were going gray, or were also dun, etc. You might have thought ____ was a bay dun, when it was actually a dunskin, etc.

[quote="accphotography"]How many black based (black, grullo, etc.) foals has he had? Any one of those could have been cream and you'd never have known it. Cream could also hide on some of those babies that were going gray, or were also dun, etc. You might have thought ____ was a bay dun, when it was actually a dunskin, etc.[/quote]

[color=#8000BF]
[b]All his foals except for maybe 3 or so were black based.
I did forget he had a dunalino filly out of a buckskin mare.
Let me see if I can find pics of her.[/b][/color]

[color=#8000BF][b]Ok these pics are awful as she was in a BAD situation.[/b][/color]
[img]http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p149…]
[img]http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p149…]
[color=#8000BF][b]This is her dam[/b][/color]
[img]http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p149…]
[img]http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p149…]

[color=#8000BF][b]This is the dam to the gelding.[/b][/color]
[img]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v310/…]
[color=#8000BF][b]And his '09 sister...grulla[/b][/color]
[img]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v310/…]

[quote="PamelaTX"][quote="accphotography"]How many black based (black, grullo, etc.) foals has he had? Any one of those could have been cream and you'd never have known it. Cream could also hide on some of those babies that were going gray, or were also dun, etc. You might have thought ____ was a bay dun, when it was actually a dunskin, etc.[/quote]

[color=#8000BF]
[b]All his foals except for maybe 3 or so were black based.
I did forget he had a dunalino filly out of a buckskin mare.
Let me see if I can find pics of her.[/b][/color][/quote]
[color=#8000BF]
[b]SO I guess that would mean he does carry cream if he sired a dunalino foal??
[/b][/color]

Nope, because the mare had cream.

[quote="accphotography"]Nope, because the mare had cream.[/quote]

[color=#8000BF][b]Ok...man so much to take in & learn...I'm tryin...ok struggling!! lol[/b][/color]

Pamela, you can see that the dam is a buckskin so therefore she was a Bay with one dose of cream that diluted the red to become a buckskin. :D

[quote="lipigirl"]Pamela, you can see that the dam is a buckskin so therefore she was a Bay with one dose of cream that diluted the red to become a buckskin. :D[/quote]

[color=#8000BF][b]I know she's a buckskin.
The question was whether or not the sire carries cream.
The dunalino is the only known foal (that I know of) that carries cream...which the cream comes from the mare.

I may be makin things more confusing lol
[/b][/color]

I think you're asking too many questions and getting yourself confused!! :lol:
Based on the gelding's pedigree (a chestnut dam and a black sire), the gelding is black.
If the gelding carries cream, it was/is hidden in the sire's coat. But with no cream foals to fate (out of non cream mares) I think it may be pretty unlikely.
So the gelding is a fading black.
[size=85]I agree, he looks like a smokey black to me, but it is what it is![/size]

My question is how many bay-based (E- A-) or red-based (ee) foals has the stud had? If all his other offspring have been black-based (E- aa), then half of them could easily be hiding a cream gene.

[quote="Monsterpony"]My question is how many bay-based (E- A-) or red-based (ee) foals has the stud had? If all his other offspring have been black-based (E- aa), then half of them could easily be hiding a cream gene.[/quote]

[color=#8000BF][b]Well I only know of 3 red based...chestnut, red dun & dunalino...they rest (that I know of) are black based.
I guess I could spend some of my AQHA money & do a progeny search & see what I come up with.[/b][/color]

What color was the dam of the dunalino?

[quote="accphotography"]What color was the dam of the dunalino?[/quote]

[color=#8000BF][b]Its posted above...she's a buckskin[/b][/color]