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Ok....bay dun or grulla with roan & gray???

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PamelaTX
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Ok....bay dun or grulla with roan & gray???
Ok I dunno if y'all will remember or not about My Lacey's sire & all sorts of colors he throws. Well I showed pics of this filly before in that thread. Anyway. Here are some new pics of her. I don't agree that she's grulla. I seriously think bay or red dun with roan & gray, but would love y'alls opinions. The owner thinks grulla + roan. This filly is a half sister to my Lacey. Dam was sorrel & sire is grullo/roan/gray. IMO her head never came in black....looks brown/red so thats why I don't say grulla. But now you can REALLY see the GRAY!! (oh & for the longest time everyone called all of Sneeker's color & his offsprings color SILVER...which is nonexistent in his lines...plus wouldn't the mane on a black actually be SILVER?? lol) Her blaze is almost nonexistent now...from what I can see. Here's a link to some of her younger pics... http://s50.photobucket.com/albums/f345/Shelzbiz/Ditto/?start=all" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; And most recent (takin the other day)... IMAGE(http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f345/Shelzbiz/021-9.jpg) IMAGE(http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f345/Shelzbiz/022-10.jpg) IMAGE(http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f345/Shelzbiz/053-1.jpg) IMAGE(http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f345/Shelzbiz/051-4.jpg) IMAGE(http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f345/Shelzbiz/049-2.jpg) IMAGE(http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f345/Shelzbiz/050-2.jpg)
accphotography
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Re: Ok....bay dun or grulla with roan & gray???

I'm inclined to think red dun with gray.

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CMhorses
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Re: Ok....bay dun or grulla with roan & gray???

Would the greying cause the legs to get so dark? She does look really red, too red to be black based imo.

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PamelaTX
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Re: Ok....bay dun or grulla with roan & gray???

The word GRAY seems to be a no no...dunno why.
The owner doesn't believe gray at all. She said oh I'd love to have a gray, but she's not gray.
What else would cause the head to be like that & the legs & oh lets see the blonde in the end of the tail??

She's bred & will foal in February of next year. I guess if she throws a gray foal MAYBE they'll believe it!!! :laugh1 :twisted:

This is her website if anyone wants to take a peek.
She's called Six Silver Sneekers

http://www.freewebs.com/shelzbiz/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

accphotography
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Re: Ok....bay dun or grulla with roan & gray???

She is absolutely, 100%, no question gray.

Yes gray does darken the red before it lightens it. Usually chestnuts go black and then start graying out. That's why we say it's impossible to tell the original color once the gray has gotten to a certain point.

The thing that says red dun is how red the pasterns are with how black the mane and tail is. Which is also what says gray to me (along with the very obvious face).

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PamelaTX
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Re: Ok....bay dun or grulla with roan & gray???

Yep!! I agree!!

Question...just wonderin...as I don't really know, but can gray darken the dorsal??

accphotography
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Re: Ok....bay dun or grulla with roan & gray???

Oh definitely. Gray can even create a VERY distinct dorsal where there wasn't one before.

This is a gray Thoroughbred (sorry for the quality, it's a cell phone photo of a tv screen):
IMAGE(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w65/accphotography/IMG00206.jpg)

I've heard people say if you have a foal or horse that looks VERY dun but there is no dun in the pedigree and there is gray, the horse is gray no matter whether it looks like it or not. Gray really brings out dun factor that wouldn't normally be there (or enhances what is already there).

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PamelaTX
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Re: Ok....bay dun or grulla with roan & gray???

Thats what I was thinkin...as her dorsal doesn't look so red, but everywhere else says red...to me!! lol

I read that somewhere about some grays...that they can have dorsals.
That one looks so distinct & dark.

I wonder what make sit do that??

accphotography
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Re: Ok....bay dun or grulla with roan & gray???

Gray takes the bony areas last (spine, knees, ankles, legs in general really, bones on the face, etc.). It doesn't really make it darker, it just lightens everything around it. As far as turning the red dorsal dark, well it would have done that to the body too, not just the dorsal. That's just gray's MO, darken, then whiten.

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Re: Ok....bay dun or grulla with roan & Gray???

She is Grey, why would the owner not think she is Grey??
She is obviously Grey!

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Daylene Alford
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Re: Ok....bay dun or grulla with roan & gray???

I don't think she's red based. My dad has a dun + gray mare that could be her carbon copy as far as color is concerned.
Look closely at the color that remains on her head. It doesn't look red to me. It looks like she could be a buckskin or dun under the gray.

Example red based gray.

IMAGE(http://www.dipperaranch.com/gallery/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=3293&g2_serialNumber=1)

Buckskin + gray (proven by breeding)
IMAGE(http://www.dipperaranch.com/gallery/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=3106&g2_serialNumber=1)

rabbitsfizz
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Re: Ok....bay dun or grulla with roan & gray???

My Buckskin based Grey mare just went Grey, no hint of Buckskin in her at all, white based body, huge rocking horse dapples, black mane and tail.

website: please come and visit... http://www.shadowplayminihorses.co.uk/

accphotography
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Re: Ok....bay dun or grulla with roan & gray???

There's just too much red on the legs for me to think black based.

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CheyAut
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Re: Ok....bay dun or grulla with roan & gray???

I was also thinking a red based grey.

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PamelaTX
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Re: Ok....bay dun or grulla with roan & Gray???

She is Grey, why would the owner not think she is Grey??
She is obviously Grey!

You got me...I dunno why she doesn't accept it or see it.
Although she might & she just may be in denial. Dunno.

Fledgesflight
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Re: Ok....bay dun or grulla with roan & gray???

If she's not Grey- I don't know what is!!! lol

I think that because she appears to be a Classic Roan, and Grey darkens base colours, the Grey went un-noticed.

I think Red based too...
IMAGE(http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f345/Shelzbiz/Ditto/Picture675.jpg)

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Re: Ok....bay dun or grulla with roan & gray???

[b]The word GRAY seems to be a no no...dunno why.
The owner doesn't believe gray at all. She said oh I'd love to have a gray, but she's not gray.
What else would cause the head to be like that & the legs & oh lets see the blonde in the end of the tail??

She's bred & will foal in February of next year. I guess if she throws a gray foal MAYBE they'll believe it!!! :laugh1 :twisted:[/b]

This is her website if anyone wants to take a peek.
She's called Six Silver Sneekers

http://www.freewebs.com/shelzbiz/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

WOW! That just seems so weird to me. I mean, that horse is Jazzy's age or younger. It doesn't say the month she was born, but it says that in August 07 she was a yearling. Good lord! So if she was born in August, say, then she's still just a baby! Due in Feb you said?! so bred in April of this year. Nope, I just don't see breeding a 3 year old as reasonable... I know people do it, but...why?! Is that safe? There's no way I could look at Jazz (born Feb 06) and say "Yes, that is breeding quality" or "No, definatly not!" She hasn't shown her true colors yet. I mean, she's shown me her conformation, that's not going to change much, but I don't know if she's going to be completely nuts! I dunno, just seems unessesary. I guess it's just so weird because I could never imagine breeding Jazz at this point in her life, and she could be older than that mare.

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PamelaTX
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Re: Ok....bay dun or grulla with roan & gray???

I believe she was born in either January or February of '06.
I know what ya mean, but people do it.
Some halter breeders have bred 2 yr olds so they're 3 when they foal.

I do remember her sayin that she was born red dun.
But there have been other foals by him born red dun then shed grullo or well it could just be the gray takin over.
I Hadn't thought about that, but since gray darkens the legs & such it could just be gray.

Phoxjuice
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Bay dun

Did she look like this when she was 3?

 

 

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