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clarification on silver

In the silver album there is a picture of a buckskin (appearing) mare, the caption says she is silver. Her name is Rosmel's Golden Wonder. I thought silver diluted the mane and tail of black based horses? Hence a sliver bay is reddish body with silver mane and tail. Thank you for explaining.

RiddleMeThis Sat, 12/26/2009 - 01:33

[quote="colorfan"]In the silver album there is a picture of a buckskin (appearing) mare, the caption says she is silver. Her name is Rosmel's Golden Wonder.
I thought silver diluted the mane and tail of black based horses? Hence a sliver bay is reddish body with silver mane and tail.

Thank you for explaining.[/quote]
He is actually a stallion.

Silver DOES dilute the mane and tail (and sometimes body) of black based horses. However, sometimes, when paired with cream, silver expresses much more minimally, and sometimes not at all.

accphotography Sat, 12/26/2009 - 01:54

There are even some non cream horses that have tested positive for silver and still have very black looking manes and tails. It's just expression variance. Not every horse will look the same.

RiddleMeThis Sat, 12/26/2009 - 04:27

[quote="Fledgesflight"]Some horses with Silver lose the colouration associated with it. He was one of them.

http://www.willowbendfarm.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;[/quote]
I personally don't even think any of his color was from silver originally. He looks very similar to some buckskins that arent silver. I wouldn't have even guessed at silver from any of this photos.

rabbitsfizz Sat, 12/26/2009 - 11:37

In Minis, at least, Buckskin can be Silver without it looking at all Silver. My stallions sire is a good example. Visually, he is a Buckskin.
Genetically, he is a Silver Buckskin.
It varies a lot!!!
Cream does seem, though, to suppress the expression of Silver.

Fledgesflight Sat, 12/26/2009 - 17:01

[quote="accphotography"]But what about the non silver buckskins that look just like him?[/quote]

What- as foals or now?

Here's a few for you Fizz:
http://www.grandmesaminis.com/stallions…" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://www.equinenow.com/horse-ad-189544" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://www.miniaturehorse.eu/double_d_k…" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I am of strong belief that Cream does nothing at all to Silver...especially since there are Silver horses out there with no cream, having even less of an expression to the ones I've posted.

I would still like to see some Buckskin foals with no Silver, looking like the OP horse as a foal though.

rabbitsfizz Sun, 12/27/2009 - 09:14

[img]http://www.ujenik.com/extasy1big.jpg[/i…]
My stallions sire LK Double Extasy
[img]http://www.ujenik.com/destiny2.jpg[/img]
His grandsire, Alvadar Double Destiny, both Silver Buckskins.
FF the first example you give shows Silver quite clearly.
The second one, I do actually wonder if it is Champagne??
The last is typical of Minis Silver Buckskin, very similar to the store and grandsire of my boy!

accphotography Sun, 12/27/2009 - 20:24

I've seen plenty of buckskin foals that could have passed for palomino they had so little (or no) black on them and no silver. I've also seen older buckskin with so much frosting one would have to question if they could be silver.

Fledgesflight Sun, 12/27/2009 - 21:07

Gorgeous horses Fizz- (if the top horse, from the other-side, looks anything like the mare in the last link, then I still say it looks Silver! :booty )

The ad for the colt in the second link says he's been tested Homozygous for Silver.

[quote="accphotography"]I've seen plenty of buckskin foals that could have passed for palomino they had so little (or no) black on them and no silver. I've also seen older buckskin with so much frosting one would have to question if they could be silver.[/quote]

At 6 weeks old?

I've never seen a frosted Buckskin that looks like it could pass as Silver, would you care to share?

Fledgesflight Sun, 12/27/2009 - 23:36

lol..I know they're not that unusual- Just never seen any that look like that they could be mistaken for Silver.

I'd like to see the Buckskins (without Silver) looking really blonde at 6 weeks or so though.

accphotography Sun, 12/27/2009 - 23:57

Buckskin with frosting. I'm not sure what he looked like at exactly 6 weeks though. Most people thought he was palomino for a long time. I've seen another just like him except he had a white mane and tail and he shed out buckskin too.

Fledgesflight Mon, 12/28/2009 - 00:18

He looks really neat, however he doesn't look like he has Silver as to the OP horse when he was younger.

Dilutes Mon, 12/28/2009 - 07:55

I know he's only a yearling in the pic but looking at his points (the bucky with frosting) do you think he could be a wild buckskin (as in wild bay)? If so could this also increase the frosting as I've noticed wild bays with frosting?

Also the pictures showing the silver buckskins looking rather dark maned or just buckskin in appearance, could they possibly be dyed/darkened for showing/photos? Some of the pictures I've looked at show short to mid length manes. If I cut my silver bay mare's mane to a reasonable length, her dark roots could give the impression she doesn't have a flaxen mane as the dark roots are quite long. Not so noticable with her thick, long flaxen mane though.

Fledgesflight Mon, 12/28/2009 - 18:54

[quote="Dilutes"]
Also the pictures showing the silver buckskins looking rather dark maned or just buckskin in appearance, could they possibly be dyed/darkened for showing/photos? Some of the pictures I've looked at show short to mid length manes. If I cut my silver bay mare's mane to a reasonable length, her dark roots could give the impression she doesn't have a flaxen mane as the dark roots are quite long. Not so noticable with her thick, long flaxen mane though.[/quote]

Good point!! This is a mare I used to ride, aged 14 in the photo's but is now in her late 20's- I used to think that her mane and tail would look [b][i]way[/i] [/b]better dyed as I had no clue as to what colour she really was- (thought she was just an odd Buckskin whose mane and tail decided that they didn't want to be normal!)[img]http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b276/…]
Here is the mane flipped:
[img]http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b276/…]
The photo's aren't the best (photo's of photo's), but there is no true black to the darker bits- it was dark chocolate coloured, the same as her legs.
She still remains looking the same.

rabbitsfizz Tue, 12/29/2009 - 13:54

I thought that, especially as they are Minis, but, no, they are not dyed, I have seen the sire for myself and his mane and tail are black (believe me I know a dyed mane and tail when I see one!!)
The horse was not being shown, so there would have been no point to doing it, either.
Buckaroo has a black mane and tail and his is not dyed (he is 31 years old and the grandsire of Alvadars Double Destiny, btw)
as foals all three of these horses were "buttermilk" coloured and had almost self coloured manes and tails, with a darker "spine" running up the middle, similar to Fjords.

Fledgesflight Tue, 12/29/2009 - 17:47

Some Silvers don't seem to hold onto their Silver colouring-Thowood's Silver Black Australian riding pony colt is a good example of that.

IMO The OP horse as a young horse, looked Silver before it's colouring disappeared (or was dyed).

thorwood Thu, 01/07/2010 - 16:12

Yes, I would definitely say that silver can exist with very minimal expression.
For those who haven't seen him, here is my boy, & he is a tested silver carrier, & also his mum, who is very obvious.

[attachment=1]aussies.jpg[/attachment]

[attachment=0]DSC_6116.jpg[/attachment]

Dilutes Fri, 01/08/2010 - 07:25

He isn't up to scratch sorry. I better come and remove him for you :D
Oh okay I will admit it, he is STUNNING! So is his mum!

rabbitsfizz Fri, 01/08/2010 - 11:03

Nah, definitely not worth keeping, I would send him back to the homeland, if I were you.....
What made you test him, just curiosity or a hunch??

thorwood Sat, 01/09/2010 - 20:32

Rabbit,

Yes, ACC is right, he was rather obviously silver as a foal & early yearling. Then his "silver" mane & tail started growing out.
I knew he was silver, but wanted a piece of paper to verify it, as he is staying as a "boy".
Also, he is the ONLY black silver stallion in our Riding Pony Studbook (the only silver entire of any colour), & most probably the only one
anywhere, as I cannot imagine there are any in the UK studbook (though of course possible).

Have to admit, if I saw him now & didn't know his parents, I would be unsure what colour he is!!!! We showed him last season & while most people commented
on his colour only one person got it right!!!

Here are some baby pics.

One week old.
[img]http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i54/t…]

Foal pics.

[img]http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i54/t…]

After weaning
[img]http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i54/t…]