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Another "Surprise" Splash

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thorwood
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Another "Surprise" Splash
This one is a welsh cob, both parents have some leg/face white, but not excessive. Breeders were extremely shocked, & as the rules go for welshies here in Oz this one is actually not registerable, despite being purebred. [attachment=0]DSC05327.jpg[/attachment]
dakotakdq
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Re: Another "Surprise" Splash

lovley!

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accphotography
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Re: Another "Surprise" Splash

What a SHAME!!! How stupid. She's really, really nice. *sigh*

IMAGE(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w65/accphotography/Misc/Sig.png) IMAGE(http://phrf.pitapata.com/uno2m5.png)

RiddleMeThis
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Re: Another "Surprise" Splash

Reminds me a lot of my favorite mini stallion
IMAGE(http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b236/Riddle_Me_This/Loud%20Splashes/8cf28d09.jpg?t=1275346354)

And a slightly louder version of this
IMAGE(http://morgancolors.com/31307Queencoltcanterleft1.jpg)

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Danni
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Re: Another "Surprise" Splash

Oh I've got some older pictures of this filly. I didn't realise she couldn't be registered, that sucks big time!!!

Would she be able to be registered if in the UK?

Welsh Cob people in Oz seem so snobby about colours. I know someone with a perlino I think it was born, and she's had quite a few nasty comments.

thorwood
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Re: Another "Surprise" Splash

Riddle, love the mini stallion, he has beautiful markings but would be a lovely type without them.

ACC, unfortunately welsh standard says no broken colour, so I guess they can't really register him, but I think they were entering in to discussions.
I don't think the Welsh Soc in the UK allows broken colour either & neither does the US society!!!
I think some colour education is required. :BH

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accphotography
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Re: Another "Surprise" Splash

This is the other side of the foal RMT posted and I agree with her, extremely similar:

IMAGE(http://memcmorgans.com/2007Foals/tn_MEMCOnTarget-032307_01.jpg)

IMAGE(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w65/accphotography/Misc/Sig.png) IMAGE(http://phrf.pitapata.com/uno2m5.png)

thorwood
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Re: Another "Surprise" Splash

Danni, I don't think it is so much snobby, as just totally unaware of colour genetics.
Heavens, the UK mob have only just figured out dun & buckskin are different.
At least here we can now register buckskins, which were previously reg. as dun.
Cremellos etc used to be registered as cream, which was very confusing.
We didn't even have a name for smoky black, now we can reg. them as dilute black which is better than nothing.

Many of the older welsh breeders here have no idea that cream & dun are different genes & most haven't heard
of sabino or splash!!!

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Songcatcher
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Re: Another "Surprise" Splash

... as the rules go for welshies here in Oz this one is actually not registerable, despite being purebred.

Their loss. I love the markings.

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Kylie_80
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Re: Another "Surprise" Splash

WOW - gorgeous!

Danni
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Re: Another "Surprise" Splash

Here is another couple of her. Does it mean it's not really a breed when you can't register a foal from two purebred parents ;-)

IMAGE(http://img37.imageshack.us/img37/310/dsc06123j.jpg)
IMAGE(http://img205.imageshack.us/img205/1529/dsc06135l.jpg)

accphotography
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Re: Another "Surprise" Splash

Yes, IMO it does sadly. Especially when it's a foal that nice.

IMAGE(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w65/accphotography/Misc/Sig.png) IMAGE(http://phrf.pitapata.com/uno2m5.png)

Jenks
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Re: Another "Surprise" Splash

They will come out of the dark ages as the Quarter Horse Registry here did one day if enough voices protest. Until then? Sigh. It is a cryin' shame.

thorwood
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Re: Another "Surprise" Splash

I guess though, that is the point of a standard, to set down what is acceptable & what isn't within the breed. Many breeds of dogs have disqualifying characteristics in their standards, related to colour/markings & no one really argues with that. Many breeds have specific height limits too.

Mind you, I think the no broken colour thing in welshies means no tobiano or frame, & due to general lack of knowledge regarding colour genetics, the powers that be don't realise or understand that sabino & splash which are soooooo common in welshies, can at times produce true broken coloured patterns. The wheels move very slowly, but they are moving.

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Andrea
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Re: Another "Surprise" Splash

But to disqualify and foal based on something that is so prevalent. Might as well disqualify the sire/dam if they really want to get rid of it...

That foal is nice and I'm sure it will find a good home with someone who likes to be different!

thorwood
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Re: Another "Surprise" Splash

Yes, I agree Andrea. That's what I am saying, the standard needs to be reworded, & not just here in the UK & US too.

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accphotography
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Re: Another "Surprise" Splash

They allow brokens here.

IMAGE(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w65/accphotography/Misc/Sig.png) IMAGE(http://phrf.pitapata.com/uno2m5.png)

thorwood
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Re: Another "Surprise" Splash

Um ACC, this from the Welsh Pony & Cob Soc. of America inc, straight from the standards.

Color: Any color except piebald and skewbald.

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Danni
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Re: Another "Surprise" Splash

But piebald and skewbald usually applys to the tobianos?

Jenks
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Re: Another "Surprise" Splash

They usually apply to a bald (white) face I thought.....I don't know about the rules either way. I know that if I developed a breed that was color specific? No no, that would never happen. If a person develops a breed and you go into that breed? You should know the rules, and if a pattern is in your breed that is unaccepted? You should leave the breed if you cannot or do not want to risk getting an un- registerable foal. Me? Purebred is purebred to a certain extent (it's all invented at some point by people who decide to selectively breed for things agreed on), but it's all in what's selected by a particular board. Come up with your own breed or protest if you don't like it IMHO. patterns are not liked in arabs. Well I like 'em. Lucky for me they forgot to exclude em they were so rare.

accphotography
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Re: Another "Surprise" Splash

Then care to explain how this is registered?

IMAGE(http://www.thepromisewelsh.com/images/sioux-two-sides.jpg)

They're apparently not following their own rules.

IMAGE(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w65/accphotography/Misc/Sig.png) IMAGE(http://phrf.pitapata.com/uno2m5.png)

thorwood
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Re: Another "Surprise" Splash

Piebald & skewbald are just general terms like pinto, they don't describe the pattern, other than being broken. That's why the welsh soc won't recognize the broken coloured splashes, because in their eyes they are piebald or skewbald.

I am on a US pony breeders forum, & someone had a foal like the one posted, a couple of years back & she said it couldn't be registered pure welsh, it had be registered half welsh. The could well have relaxed their rego requirements, but they haven't changed the wording in the standard.

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thorwood
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Re: Another "Surprise" Splash

Acc, to be honest, I have no idea how it is registered. I only know what I read in the US standard.

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thorwood
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Re: Another "Surprise" Splash

Another thing to ponder, just because something is purebred, doesn't mean it fits the standard of excellence for the breed!!!

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Danni
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Re: Another "Surprise" Splash

That could happen with more than just colour though, and rarely policed?

thorwood
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Re: Another "Surprise" Splash

In Australia not so much, but in most of Europe, stallions must pass breed assessments before being allowed to breed.
Some of the UK Mountain & Moorland breeds have stallion assessment procedures as well.
Doesn't matter if they are pure, if they don't make the grade according to the powers that be, then that's it!!!
Hmm, I saw a doco about one of the state run studs in Europe, those stallions that didn't make the grade at assessment time, were promptly sold for meat.

Even in Oz, most stallions must pass a veterinary assessment before being given an adult registration. They are DNA'd for parentage as well.

LOL, of course people can breed with terrible mares & there is not much to stop them.

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tbtash
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Re: Another "Surprise" Splash

I reckon she is just brilliant what a gem :love
Let me know if she is for sale we love broken colours at our house :-D
Congrats
P.S is she silver?

tbtash
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Re: Another "Surprise" Splash

just had a another squiz..she is black ;-)

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Re: Another "Surprise" Splash

Register her in the UK then transfer her.....

And yes, she is registerable in the UK the WP&Cob Society are being dragged, kicking and screaming, into the 21st Century, about the only good thing to come out of the EU!!!

The US Welsh Society has different rules and different height requirements, so a registration in that would not count in Oz, but a registration in the "Mother Society" I think, would have to?

The Welsh Pony and Cob Society was established in 1901 by landowners, farmers and those interested in the Welsh Breeds, who recognised the importance of documenting and recording the pedigrees of Welsh Ponies and Cobs. In 1902, the Society published the first volume of the Welsh Stud Book, which, today contains the breeding details of four 'Sections' of Welsh Pony/Cob:

•Section A, the Welsh Mountain Pony, not exceeding 121.9 cm (12 h.h.)
•Section B, the Welsh Pony, not exceeding 137.2 cm (13.2 h.h.)
•Section C, the Welsh Pony (Cob Type), not exceeding 137.2 cm (13.2 h.h.)
•Section D, the Welsh Cob, over 137.2 cm (13.2 h.h.) no upper limit
I think it probably counts as a "breed" since it has been on the mountains since Roman times (first documented).
That foal, the hill men would just register and not mention her pattern, they did it time and time again with the Sec A's, especially the ones that went Grey! I do not think I have ever seen a Sec A without Splash or Sabino, although I am sure one does exist.

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Re: Another "Surprise" Splash

RMT that's the Reece's stallion isn't it? He is very flashy !

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Re: Another "Surprise" Splash

The mini is Nostalgias Show Me The Money from Nostalgia Farm.
http://www.nostalgiafarm.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The morgan is MEMC On Target from MEMC Morgans.
http://www.memcmorgans.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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