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colorfan
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about gray
I have a couple of gray mares. I am amazed at the comments and ideas people have about gray/grey. so what 'do' we know about gray?? One parent must be gray. Gray turns whiter with age. I have heard that a homozygous gray will whiten faster than a single copy. (However, my single copy girl is turning white quickly and is much whiter than the other gray at the same age) My observation is gray is not as bothered by bugs or nose flies as badly as bays. (No chestnut-no observation) Someone has proposed that you can always tell a gray base color by the leg color. A bay gray will have dark points and dark legs. Personally I am not sure about that, I know one of my grays is a chestnut base, she seems to have dark legs,(dark being a reletive term). The other gray (unknown base) is changing more slowly and does have darker points. Wondering......could lighter bases turn whiter faster than darker bases? please jump in........
RiddleMeThis
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Re: about gray

I have a couple of gray mares. I am amazed at the comments and ideas people have about gray/grey.

so what 'do' we know about gray??

One parent must be gray.
Gray turns whiter with age.

I have heard that a homozygous gray will whiten faster than a single copy. (However, my single copy girl is turning white quickly and is much whiter than the other gray at the same age)

Homozygous grays do gray faster than heterozygous grays. Theres also some information about Agouti and melanomas caused by gray either increase or decreasing the risk but I cant remember if its "a" or "A" that does it.

Someone has proposed that you can always tell a gray base color by the leg color. A bay gray will have dark points and dark legs.
Personally I am not sure about that, I know one of my grays is a chestnut base, she seems to have dark legs,(dark being a reletive term).
The other gray (unknown base) is changing more slowly and does have darker points.

Wondering......could lighter bases turn whiter faster than darker bases?

please jump in........

Not true about the leg color. MANY red bases go REALLY dark before they lighten. ESPECIALLY the legs. This is a palomino going gray and look how dark her legs have gotten.
IMAGE(http://www.warmblood-color.com/images/Foals/Franka/4_6_08_6daysOld/Franka_6days_079.jpg)

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accphotography
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Re: about gray

'A' can protect a horse from melanomas.

Agree that it's not true one can tell the base color by the legs. Not unless the horse is still a foal and maybe not even then.

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colorfan
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Re: about gray

Are you saying that A (agouti) so a bay gray will not have the melanomas usually assosiated with gray?

Gray babies are really different.

Oh, grays don't always have goggles to indicate they will turn gray either.

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accphotography
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Re: about gray

It's not a 100% thing, but having 'A' or even being 'AA' can definitely greatly reduce the occurrence of melanomas. All of the horses I've personally known that had melanomas were ALL 'aa'.

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Third Peppermint
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Re: about gray

That's so cool! Are there any journal articles about it anywhere yet?

lipigirl
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Re: about gray

I must admit that I did not see any melanomas in the Lipizzaners, but then I think most of them were Black/Bay based so....

Oh yes Colorfan, don't forget that like the little guy in my Avatar, if you have silver with grey it excellerates the greying process so that they can even be born pure white. my little guy is a silver black pinto with grey and was pure white by weaning.

accphotography
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Re: about gray

Indeed. I think the articles post here lists the gray article that mentions it.

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JNFerrigno
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Re: about gray

Don't forget pinky syndrome. I forgot how it was put, but basically grey is unstable I think. When I think of grey, I think of these two thoroughbreds that were exceptions to the 'rules'. One foal out of a chestnut mare came out almost completely greyed out (I don't remember who the sire was, some race horse). And the other was this hunter jumper I saw at a local show. Completely white body, silvered mane and tail, and stark black legs where the points would be. After talking to the rider, she didn't know what his foal color was, but said he was 11 years old.

Jenks
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Re: about gray

? huh? I completely do not understand JNF! LOL

colorfan
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Re: about gray

That is the problem with gray is it covers other cool colors.
I am considering breeding my 2nd gray but because of her color am hesitating. I figure if I am breeding may as well try for color as well as brains and ability. I don't like the odds of 50% gray.

Has anyone noticed that grays are bothered by bugs as much as other colors?

When I ride I feel His pleasure.

accphotography
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Re: about gray

? huh? I completely do not understand JNF! LOL

Right with ya.

And Colorfan I haven't personally seen it, but I read a study about that somewhere.

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Rusti
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Re: about gray

I dunno about any of the other stuff, but my neighbor that I used to trail ride with has a gray gelding and I guess he started out black or bay because he still had a black mane a few years ago, but that horse was ALWAYS covered in bumps from bites and bloody streaks and constantly getting pestered by horseflies (this neighbor is also anti fly spray...I rode with him for 4 years and saw him use it once). More so than the bay gelding I was riding at the time and the sorrel mare my fiance rides. She rarely needs fly spray. In the order that flies bother our horses (from least flies to most flies) I'd say it's: 1. sorrel mare 2. bay gelding 3. smokey brown gelding 4. sorrel med. hat mare.

RiddleMeThis
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Re: about gray

IMO don't trust, or take with a large grain of salt, any color you see on a gray.

Anyone wanna guess the base color of this gray?
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lipigirl
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Re: about gray

Gonna guess buckskin.

Monsterpony
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Re: about gray

I can't remember where I read it, but a paper was recently published that showed bays attract more insects than lighter colored horses. It was recommended to cover dark horses with light colored sheets to reduce bug problems.

.

accphotography
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Re: about gray

Oh really!?!? I thought it was grays.

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Jenks
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Re: about gray

I don't have bays, but my 2 chestnuts are definitely more plagued by bugs than my two greys.

Khaos is getting vitiligo under his mane too - I think - does that only happen to greys? His mother (grey) does not have any vitiligo - neither does his chestnut sire. And it's under his mane which is odd, but I can start another thread for it....I'm wondering if fungus, etc can cause the skin to turn? Maybe that's it? It's been hot and wet here, and admittedly, I didn't spray tea cleanz under his mane - until now anyway.

Maigray
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Re: about gray

I'll guess palomino.

Jenks - it happens to other colors too. This is Wachlarz in post #515, posted by Mr. Reed: http://forums.ablackhorse.com/index.php?..." onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Jenks
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Re: about gray

OMG. Please don't let him get it on his face!

colorfan
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Re: about gray

IMO don't trust, or take with a large grain of salt, any color you see on a gray.

Anyone wanna guess the base color of this gray?
IMAGE(http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b236/Riddle_Me_This/5cf0f4ec.jpg?t=1280440888)

Hmm, so what color is he? How old in the picture?

When I ride I feel His pleasure.

RiddleMeThis
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Re: about gray

LOL she is palomino and shes is two in that photo. Its the same palomino going gray filly that I posted earlier in the thread as a few day old foal.

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JNFerrigno
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Re: about gray

Don't forget pinky syndrome. I forgot how it was put, but basically grey is unstable I think. When I think of grey, I think of these two thoroughbreds that were exceptions to the 'rules'. One foal out of a chestnut mare came out almost completely greyed out (I don't remember who the sire was, some race horse). And the other was this hunter jumper I saw at a local show. Completely white body, silvered mane and tail, and stark black legs where the points would be. After talking to the rider, she didn't know what his foal color was, but said he was 11 years old.

Ah sorry guys, there was a method to my madness, and I would have gave you the key except I've been without internet for a few days and just got my computer back tonight. Pinky Syndrome is what us simpletons call vitiligo (and when we can't remember how to spell or say vitiligo LOL).

The rest was just me rambling about two grey horses I came across, who didn't really follow the 'rules' of grey.

Jenks
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Re: about gray

Ah..... My grey with what I think is vitiligo is not as sharp as the example Maigrey posted. I'll have to take some pics.

Maigray
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Re: about gray

Greys can start greying out in-utero and come out greying already.

Krickette
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Re: about gray

Greys can start greying out in-utero and come out greying already.

Yup, I know a tennessee walker like that! He's covered in fleabites now.
Mist got more fleabites with age, which I suppose is normal. My best guess is she was bay based, she had black legs when I got her and a lot of her spots were brown.
Jazz is...special haha. She has taken her sweet time getting just as grey as she is, which is actually fairly grey now. I mean, it's obvious that's what color she is now, I don't have to refer to her as "black going grey".
And I don't know about the bug thing, Mist had terribly sensitive skin compared to my bays. She had problems with noseeums, too, which none of my other horses have.

Mist had vitiligo, she had the lipsticks and when you wet her down she was covered in spots of pink skin.

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colorfan
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Re: about gray

Seems to me I read something about fleabites on grays.....not all grays get them. something like the bites are hairs holding onto their color or it coming back??
anybody else hear something like this?

When I ride I feel His pleasure.

colorfan
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Re: about gray

hmmph, palomino hey...wow, that is what I worry about, getting a cool color and it going gray.

Wonder why gray goes funky over dilutes?
I mean with palomino being so light wouldn't you think gray would just go over top and the overall color would appear lighter quicker?

When I ride I feel His pleasure.

accphotography
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Re: about gray

It's not just cream, it's all colors. They all start dark. Gray starts with hyperpigmentation.

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Krickette
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Re: about gray

It's not just cream, it's all colors. They all start dark. Gray starts with hyperpigmentation.

yup!
baby Jazz:
http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/photos-ak-as..." onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
4 year old Jazz:
http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-a..." onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

she was jet black, as opposed to the mousy black that black foals are born as.

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colorfan
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Re: about gray

er.. are you saying most grays start out darker than gray? I know all grays don't start out as a black or dark color.
sorry still can't figure out how to post a picture here.

When I ride I feel His pleasure.

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